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Orangetown Council Votes to Charge County for Road Utilities

Maintenance would include streetlights, traffic lights and fire hydrants on county roads

The Orangetown Town Council approved a resolution at Tuesday’s meeting to .

Two weeks ago, the Clarkstown Town Board approved a similar resolution, as all to the county. According to the resolution passed at the Orangetown meeting on Tuesday, a review of the utilities showed that Orangetown was paying for the costs to maintain street lights, traffic lights and fire hydrants along county roads within the town, while the county has a highway department to maintain highway roads.


A discussion about the resolution Tuesday night touched on whether or not it was vindictive of the towns to charge the county for such utilities. Earlier this year, the county shifted the costs for election expenses and community college chargebacks to the towns. Last Wednesday, Rockland County Legislator Ilan Schoenberger strongly criticized the towns' plan.

Ultimately, the resolution passed Tuesday by a vote of 4-1 with Councilman Denis Troy voting against it.

“This is just counterproductive in doing the same thing that they did and I think we’re heading down the wrong path,” Troy said. “I believe what they did was dead wrong, particularly doing it in the middle of the year. It doesn’t make us any more right.”

Councilman Thomas Diviny said he didn’t think the resolution was vindictive or counterproductive.

“You can’t put a budget out there which we rely on and go back and forth, and then change it mid-stream,” Diviny said.

Part of the reason Diviny said he was in favor of the resolution is because the county shifting costs to the towns in the middle of the year hurts the towns’ budgets.

“You can’t expect the towns to make up for your mistakes in the past,” he said. “We are very conservative with our budgets and we had no reason to think the county would do this to us. We can’t budget effectively, especially with the two-percent cap.”

Pearl River resident Michael Mandel was the only person to speak about the issue during public comments. He sided with Diviny and the others who voted in favor of the resolution.

“It’s going to destroy our budgetary process this year, a process that everybody on the board worked very hard on,” Mandel said of the county chargebacks.

Supervisor Andy Stewart had another reason for voting in favor of the resolution, which was simply it makes sense for accountability as the county would be paying for county roads. 

“You often hear the statement that all the taxes come out of the taxpayers’ pocket and what difference does it make which government scale is charging it? It makes a really big difference in terms of accountability if we’re responsible for our budget and they’re responsible for their budget,” Stewart said. “Granted, it’s all going to paid for by the taxpayers in one way or another, but that taxpayer needs to know who to speak with, who to go to to find out exactly how that money is being spent. When you have cost-shifting with the tuitions and the elections and so on, the entity that’s paying for it isn’t the one that really can speak to the program and how that money’s being spent.”

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John Roache July 25, 2012 at 11:35 am
If all 5 towns charge the county back, it will probably cost the county over a million dollars, which means maybe more county layoffs. The countyhas already shed a bunch of jobs. Future layoffs might start cutting into the 100's of political patronage and family connection jobs that are in all layers of county government.
John Roache July 25, 2012 at 11:44 am
Is it possible to get an analysis of how much the town of Orangetown and its taxpayers pay into Rockland County government and how much they get back/use in services. Maybe one for each town, including Ramapo. I would love to see the break down.
Mike July 25, 2012 at 11:49 am
In all seriousness, I would like to ask the Town of Orangetown to explore the costs and practibility of seceding from the County to form our own new County. I understand that RC was created in response to a Federal mandate back in late 60s requiring more equal representation. So, if the residents of the Town decide they no longer feel adequately represented by this County, why stay in it? Do we have the fundamental right to get out and form our own County? Mr Stewart and Council, can you at least explore this request? Is this a legal option? It's clear that the majority of your constituents feel that being part of RC does not work for us. We pay more into a county government than what we get out of it. Curious how others feel about this?
John Roache July 25, 2012 at 11:55 am
Amen Mike, Amen!!!!
Jimmy July 25, 2012 at 01:20 pm
I would like the town to take a look at other services that are provided and possibly paid for by town taxpayers particularly NYS RT 304. I have seen the highway being plowed in the winter by Orangetown trucks and patrolled by Orangetown Police. We need our Highway and Police Dept's on town roads. Let NYS take care of state roads.We are definitely not getting back in services what we pay. Take a look at 304 and the PIP, they almost look like the Cross Bronx. Not maintained (overgrown and littered with garbage) and very dangerous (guardrails).
Jimmy July 25, 2012 at 01:21 pm
Ryan,
How about a story on the condition of these two highways?
Think4urself July 25, 2012 at 01:24 pm
The reasons why Westchester County has a Triple A bond rating as opposed to Rockland County's shade above junk status should be explored. With just a river dividing these two counties, why such disparate results? What does Westchester have that Rockland county doesn't have to engender one county fiscally healthy and the other county massively debt-ridden?
John Roache July 25, 2012 at 01:32 pm
Think4urself
The answer to your question is the Town of Ramapo and its block vote/religous community. There is nothing like that in Westchester. Thank Chris St. Lawrence.
Dan Quinn July 25, 2012 at 01:40 pm
@Think4urself....They have more businesses and wealthy residents overall which lead to higher tax revenues. I think what is more important is what Rockland has that they DON'T have, e.g certain communities in Ramapo. I believe most of their low income areas are also in cities, which take care of their own social services instead of the county (but I could be wrong).
@Jimmy...The town plows some of the state highways (also Routes 303 and 9W) as well as some county roads, including Orangeburg Rd/Veterans Memorial Dr. This is done as an agreement with the county and the state and they both pay Orangetown for this work.
Harvey Cedars July 25, 2012 at 02:29 pm
I didn't attend the meeting and the news article doesn't advise but in the interests of transparency and full disclosure -- I think it should be noted within this articele that Mr. Troy is an employee of the county. Mr Troy has been open about this so I expect he would agree. On a related note I think your readers would benefit from knowing how many of the elected officials have family members on the county or town payroll. I suspect not everyone has been as open as Mr. Troy.
MCD July 25, 2012 at 02:55 pm
It would be a welcome figure to see, what the Towns pay in taxes to the County as opposed to the services they receive from the County. I am sure it would be a real eye opener for many and not so much for others. For example, Lets see what Ramapo pays and what it gets back.
INTHEKNOW July 25, 2012 at 03:21 pm
Mr Schoenberger has been on the county payroll for decades and the town of Ramapo before that. His wife is a town judge, and he got his daughter a job with the county as as well. That's just what we know of...
John Roache July 25, 2012 at 03:30 pm
In the Know:
There is A LOT more than that, believe me. Where is the Orangetown Legislator John Murphy on all this? Has anyone seen or heard from him? The worst times in Rockland financial history and he goes missing? It seems the only contact he has with the his District taxpayers is every fourth September when he is running for election. Maybe he is tourinng Italy again.
Think4urself July 25, 2012 at 03:42 pm
Touring Italy again? How does one do that on a "public servant's" salary?
John Roache July 25, 2012 at 03:59 pm
He is hardly a "public servant". Seriously, where has he been. I think he is more concerned about what goes on at the Nathan Klien Institute in RPC and is oblivious to the financial conditions of the County and his legislative district. Call the Orangetown Police and file a missing persons report.
Jimmy July 25, 2012 at 04:32 pm
John,
Easy does it he is a decorated war veteran. You may not like him but go easy. Maybe you should seek elective office. I am thinking about it.
John Roache July 25, 2012 at 05:10 pm
Jimmy,
Good luck to you. We can use some new blood. As for Mr. Murphy, I know he was in the marines. I did not know he was a decorated war veteran. And I know he does a lot for people with mental illness and the people who work with them. He should be commended for that and he often is. But as a taxpayer in his legislative district, I often feel undereepresented as I never see or here from him as all of these new taxes and assessments are tacked on to my tax bill. He has been in office for 40 years as he will let you know. There is a problem on the county government level, a huge problem, and he is my representitive. I would like to know where he stands and what he is doing to protect the interests of his district. Plain and simple. I respect John Murphy as a humanitarian and thank him for his service. As a legislator for the taxpayers in his district, I feel he can be a little more active.
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